30 January 2023

Datum sed non concessum (2)

 So here are the words of King Charles after he was 'condemned':

"And, admitting, but not granting, that the people of England's Commission could grant you [this pretended power to judge and condemn a monarch] I see nothing to show that; for certainly you have never asked the question of the tenth man of this Kingdom ..."


Albertus said...

It seems to me that both the Latin " datum, sed non concessum" and the English "admitting, but not granting" mean that one admits the de facto existance of a possibility or situation, but does not agree in principle that such a possibility or situation have the right to exist.

Prayerful said...

You neatly tie in an example of conceding for the purposes of the argument' for bl Charles the Martyr was commemorated regularly in Anglican churches until 1859 as a red letter day (it is claimed Queen Victoria was responsible and convocation wasn't consulted).

Still it should be noted that while systematic and legalised persecution of Catholicism in Ireland (outside of military outrages and occasional royal or official initiatives) only came later (there were c 200 monasteries in Ireland when James I came to the throne (James G. Clarke, the Dissolution of the Monasteries) Charles seems utterly unable to do anything about the persecution and prosecution of martyr St Oliver Plunkett.

It also reminds me of a ruinous Co. Mayo church of that dedication I know a little (I just saw it and read a bit about it and not as much as NIAH and also Corkman Tarquin Blake who has an entry on it in his Abandoned Churches of Ireland):


Compton Pauncefoot said...

[From Edith Somerville's and Martin Ross's 'Irish Memories', 1917, at page 42]

'Many years ago a mission priest delivered a sermon in Irish in the bare white chapel that stands high on a hill above Ross Lake. I remember one sentence, translated for me by one of the congregation:

"Oh, black seas of Eternity, without height or depth, bay, brink or shore!  How can anyone look into your depths and neglect the salvation of his soul!'" '

PM said...

Bishop Barron has pointed out recently, in response to some of the woolly-minded stuff about 'welcoming' emanating from the synod, that the Lord's first utterance in the Gospel According to St Mark is not 'welcome!' but 'repent!'.

Thus datum, sed non concessum, that Mark is indeed the earliest of the Gospels, Our Lord's fist word in the New Testament is 'repent!'. So much for 'all are welcome but none are judged'.