tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post5614516265864507271..comments2024-03-29T01:24:45.251+00:00Comments on Fr Hunwicke's Mutual Enrichment: Apostolicae curae: flies in the ointmentFr John Hunwickehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17766211573399409633noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-39110005621510787152010-08-07T18:01:14.848+01:002010-08-07T18:01:14.848+01:00And now without typos...
Mgr Wadsworth's poin...And now without typos...<br /><br />Mgr Wadsworth's point, as I have said elsewhere, is why the West needs the complementary and Eastern contextual understanding of Holy Order as imparted and exercised within the Church. The prior argument is, then, where does the Church subsist and secondarily who then has authority to minister within her. Valid form and intention are thus safeguarded not byBishop of Ebbsfleethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02366941004713902728noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-80855552311020409552010-08-07T15:58:34.220+01:002010-08-07T15:58:34.220+01:00Mgr Wadsworth's point, as I have said elsewher...Mgr Wadsworth's point, as I have said elsewhere, is why the West needs the somplementary and Eastern contextual understanding of Holy Order as imparted and exercised within the Church. The prior argument is, then, where does the Church subsist and secondarily who then has authority to minister within her, Valid form and intention are thus safeguarded not by conscientious individuals but hy Bishop of Ebbsfleethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02366941004713902728noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-66217988743616108072010-08-07T14:13:41.834+01:002010-08-07T14:13:41.834+01:00Joshua: Yes, and the American Evangelical Episcopa...Joshua: Yes, and the American Evangelical Episcopalians' non-insistence on episcopacy for intercommunion which led to most of them forming the Reformed Episcopal Church in the late 1800s, and the Episcopalians' Open Pulpit Canon allowing non-episcopal ministers to preach, which caused a number of Anglo-Catholics to convert (William McGarvey and company, the Society of the Atonement at Ecgberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06354592772973677609noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-3398497129556741352010-08-07T13:40:48.995+01:002010-08-07T13:40:48.995+01:00To submit to "reordination" - ugly word,...To submit to "reordination" - ugly word, but you know what I mean - remains the stumbling block.<br /><br />Of course, it was the Anglo-Catholic opposition to accepting Methodist "orders" (presbyterially derived) that scuppered Anglican-Methodist reunion; and I recall a similar fuss over a certain Jerusalem bishopric exercised the minds of the Puseyites. The Church of South Joshuahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17387698013828199070noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-22820524584798000082010-08-07T13:13:35.827+01:002010-08-07T13:13:35.827+01:00Cardinal Hume was very clear that the problem with...Cardinal Hume was very clear that the problem with Anglican Orders lay in the 'nativa indoles ac spiritus' of successive rites from 1549 onwards which excluded the intention of confecting 'sacrificing priests', which the 'Dutch tutch' did nothing to remedy since it did not change the self-understanding of the Church of England with respect to its ministry. <br />An idea motupropriohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06261356560114077508noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-14905462527842980232010-08-07T12:53:32.658+01:002010-08-07T12:53:32.658+01:00Historical footnote: the Roman Rite in the last ye...Historical footnote: the Roman Rite in the last years of the golden age when the Tridentine Mass was the ordinary form had a perfectly formed married bishop with a perfectly formed wife, and he was a wayward Roman Catholic at that, Solomão Ferraz. After passing through the Presbyterians and the Anglicans he was a bishop in Carlos Duarte Costa's schismatic Brazilian church but John XXIII Ecgberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06354592772973677609noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-6599990062132740932010-08-07T12:36:27.510+01:002010-08-07T12:36:27.510+01:00Concerning this:
"The next Fly in this Woodp...Concerning this:<br /><br />"The next Fly in this Woodpile arises from the failure of the Anglican bishops who were supposed to be passing on the Tutch to do so in accordance with the protocols. It seems that some of them stopped saying anything out aloud."<br /><br />I am confused. Should not "the Anglican bishops" in the first sentence here, as well as "these gentlemenWilliam Tighehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16634494183165592707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-58593162734933215902010-08-07T12:32:34.269+01:002010-08-07T12:32:34.269+01:00As an expression of the Plain Man's Common Sen...As an expression of the Plain Man's Common Sense, this is totally unanswerable. However, the locus classicus as far as Intention is concerned is Bellarmine de Sac. in genere XXVII 8,which says something rather different. It is as well that it does, otherwise, as some members of SSPX appear to hold, the orders conferred by ultra-liberal post conciliar bishops on ultra-liberal post conciliar Fr John Hunwickehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17766211573399409633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-51902235118841390492010-08-07T12:02:22.417+01:002010-08-07T12:02:22.417+01:00The 'Dutch Touch' argument seems to have s...The 'Dutch Touch' argument seems to have something of the theology of 'abracadabra' about it. It is the content of the rite which makes the intention clear and this is an historical problem in Anglicanism, for at the time of the Reformation there was a wholesale rejection of the Catholic theology of the Sacraments in general and the Priesthood and the Mass in particular. <br /><brMgr Andrew Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12821521091262543139noreply@blogger.com