tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post474616213949201743..comments2024-03-18T20:38:40.751+00:00Comments on Fr Hunwicke's Mutual Enrichment: FilioqueFr John Hunwickehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17766211573399409633noreply@blogger.comBlogger18125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-3388964463997882382010-11-30T14:52:30.926+00:002010-11-30T14:52:30.926+00:00I believe Bede and Theodore are 'dealt with...I believe Bede and Theodore are 'dealt with' in the same way any saint's errors are dealt with - whether 'Eastern' or 'Western' errors from Eastern or Western saints. It's only once a saint's errors outweigh his/her virtues and orthodoxy, or once individual or regional theologoumena ossify into unilateral, partisan dogma that there is a problem. <br /><br />123https://www.blogger.com/profile/14514075641944568806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-47030536598119802812010-11-14T08:18:14.743+00:002010-11-14T08:18:14.743+00:00In the modern Roman Rite, is it not everywhere man...In the modern Roman Rite, is it not everywhere mandatory to kneel for the Consecration? (I speak not of whatever contrary practices have crept in, but of the rubrics themselves.) It therefore appears a certain pair of prie-dieux should have been used at least at one point during the Mass. (I am unaware of any special permission for the faithful in the Spanish realm to stand during the Joshuahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17387698013828199070noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-25380710651265675402010-11-13T22:05:27.204+00:002010-11-13T22:05:27.204+00:00Pastor in Valle,
You disappointed me a long time ...Pastor in Valle,<br /><br />You disappointed me a long time ago with your signature being added to a petition against the Old[er] Roman Liturgy at Maiden Lane.<br /><br />However, notwithstanding, and indeed irrelevant to that, the attack on Her Majesty Queen Sofia was totally unjustified. HM Queen Sofia is known for her caring and good works for Christ's poor and needy. The liturgy in Rubricariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05050302650867319277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-65822106380254707912010-11-13T17:18:58.336+00:002010-11-13T17:18:58.336+00:00I would like to know if Rubricarius then supports ...I would like to know if Rubricarius then supports the "right" of Her Majesty Queen Sophia to receive Holy Communion in the hand?Aduliohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00534730218402742905noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-44132970993613919352010-11-12T16:15:23.744+00:002010-11-12T16:15:23.744+00:00Rubricarius, you disappoint me.Rubricarius, you disappoint me.Pastor in Montehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05949810648656544072noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-61085728329558837922010-11-12T06:19:08.613+00:002010-11-12T06:19:08.613+00:00B flat,
While it is true that Rome takes its expl...B flat,<br /><br />While it is true that Rome takes its explanations not to impinge on the monarchy of the Father, how does it follow from that that they are successful? Monarchy of itself implies a single source relative to hypostatic origination. A sharing of that particular hypostatic power with the Son isn't monarchial or at least not hypostatically so. <br /><br />The Catholic side does Acolyte4236https://www.blogger.com/profile/06247421363309732839noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-51105239282627010292010-11-12T02:22:46.363+00:002010-11-12T02:22:46.363+00:00I'm with Joshua on this. This is horrible.I'm with Joshua on this. This is horrible.CPKShttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14450108415656796528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-43725878095824662492010-11-11T13:19:34.588+00:002010-11-11T13:19:34.588+00:00Some people accuse me of being ''catty'...Some people accuse me of being ''catty'' (and effeminate) - I simply point out the obvious and ask awkward questions...Patrick Sheridanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07995907911415177074noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-3237143129838180322010-11-11T01:37:46.800+00:002010-11-11T01:37:46.800+00:00I think some the above comments about Fr Blake ver...I think some the above comments about Fr Blake very rude, insinuating that he is an unlearned fool, and seem to confirm my earlier comment. That said, I hadn't paid attention to remarks about the Queen of Spain that he made, which may well be deserving of criticism; nonetheless, to make a crude joke at his expense, implying something by the use of the word "queen", demonstrates a Joshuahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17387698013828199070noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-85144216315531227622010-11-11T00:13:45.215+00:002010-11-11T00:13:45.215+00:00In response to Acolyte4236:
I doubt that a debate...In response to Acolyte4236:<br /><br />I doubt that a debate about the theology of filioque is invited by fr H's post. I stated that the theological meaning is not a particular problem to Orthodox/Roman understanding. Understanding does not entail agreement. When the filioque is "unpacked" by commentary on the Catholic side, great care seems to be taken to avoid trespass on the B flathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17611595580578224726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-48934092642244957622010-11-10T23:16:15.939+00:002010-11-10T23:16:15.939+00:00The Flying Dutchman,
Precisely! Hence my profound...The Flying Dutchman,<br /><br />Precisely! Hence my profound irritation. I was disgusted to ready Blake's calumny against Her Majesty The Queen of Spain. Of course he has basically copied his vitriol from a certain American cleric who is notorious for mouthing off other Chrisitians in indirect proportion to his liturgical knowledge.<br /><br />I have this day made representation to Bishop Rubricariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05050302650867319277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-55073488456305845292010-11-10T22:59:55.516+00:002010-11-10T22:59:55.516+00:00Joshua,
if you want to talk about "catty&quo...Joshua,<br /><br />if you want to talk about "catty", Fr Ray Blake has a really catty post about Queen SofĂa of Spain and the way she received Holy Communion from the Pope (<a href="http://marymagdalen.blogspot.com/2010/11/queens-protest.html" rel="nofollow">"The Queens Protest?"</a>).<br /><br />Cattiness, then, is not the exclusive preserve of the Anglican patrimony.The Flying Dutchmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10057552757013226176noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-67999244782084813712010-11-10T22:17:22.684+00:002010-11-10T22:17:22.684+00:00Come of what Joshua?
If the RCC has semi-illitera...Come of what Joshua?<br /><br />If the RCC has semi-illiterate clergy in it there is clearly a major problem. Standards for ordination have dropped to the bottom of the cask.<br /><br />Clearly many men have gone through the system who would not have done in better times.Rubricariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05050302650867319277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-37512510437057485672010-11-10T21:55:53.982+00:002010-11-10T21:55:53.982+00:00Bflat,
I can assure that the Orthodox object to t...Bflat,<br /><br />I can assure that the Orthodox object to the theology of the clause as well as its illigitimate insertion.<br /><br />It is also true that Rome knew of say Frankish adherence to the Filioque and opposed it for centuries, all the while turning a blind eye to it when it needed Frankish military support. It is not inconceivable that Rome ignored it for a time, hoping later to bringAcolyte4236https://www.blogger.com/profile/06247421363309732839noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-72835123060920542202010-11-10T21:12:27.150+00:002010-11-10T21:12:27.150+00:00Is it altogether impossible that the word Filioque...Is it altogether impossible that the word Filioque was intruded into Bede's text by a scandalised copyist?<br /><br />My understanding of the present controversy over this word, is that the theological meaning and interpretation is not a particular problem to Orthodox?Roman Catholic understanding. Far more intractable is the ecclesiological model which, on the one side permits, on the other B flathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17611595580578224726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-12488374518229943162010-11-10T20:35:48.098+00:002010-11-10T20:35:48.098+00:00Come, come, R., while some of us are pedantic proo...Come, come, R., while some of us are pedantic proof-readers and painfully edit our own blog posts, others simply write and post: it sounds rather catty (Patrimony?) to pick at a priest's spelling ability.Joshuahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17387698013828199070noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-17517073862532393002010-11-10T17:05:53.689+00:002010-11-10T17:05:53.689+00:00Fr. H,
I see you have caught the attention of pos...Fr. H,<br /><br />I see you have caught the attention of possible future <a href="http://marymagdalen.blogspot.com/2010/11/filoque-hunwicke-bits-of-patrimony.html" rel="nofollow">co-religionists</a>.<br /><br />I confess my ignorance of not knowing what 'filoque' (sic) is about and would never describe you as 'cummudgeonly' (sic) or even curmudgeonly, not in the least.<br /><br />Rubricariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05050302650867319277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8940364093450837549.post-14668090120775139562010-11-10T14:52:04.779+00:002010-11-10T14:52:04.779+00:00If Theodore believed the Filioque, that isn't ...If Theodore believed the Filioque, that isn't evidence of its truth or its legitimate place in the tradition per se. <br /><br />Second, if he was influenced by Maximus on this point, then he probably didn't and his expressions here should be read as expressing a Maximian view, namely of a shinning forth or an energetic procession.<br /><br />As Catholic scholars have noted (Fr. GarriguesAcolyte4236https://www.blogger.com/profile/06247421363309732839noreply@blogger.com